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| Posted: Fri Jul 27th, 2012 10:53 am |
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1st Post |
| Posted: Fri Jul 27th, 2012 12:44 pm |
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2nd Post |
Ted Johnson
Member
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Alcohol, 15/20% power boost, runs MUCH, MUCH cooler. Since you run 3 to 4 times as much thru the engine, a lot more lubricant also goes through the engine. You must modify your carbs, advance timing and raise compression to get the most out of alcohol, so the cost of your engine is higher. Since you ues 3-4 times as much per unit of air, the cost is quite a bit more. You have to run a colder spark plug, though they cost no more. You MUST purge your engine with a gasoline/oil mixture after you run alky. If you break something and cannot purge, you'll have to disassemble things and wash out the old alky. Engines seldom stick on alky, so maintenance costs may be lower. You cannot buy alky at your local service station. You can easily run castor oil with alky, as it doesn't require a blender. For my buck, castor is still the best lube on the planet, but it can leave a sticky residue in your carb, and if it sits in the engine, can stick piston rings in their grooves, stick carb inlet needles and can stick rod needles together, so PURGE WELL! Hope this helps a bit, though I've probably forgotten a few things. TJ Last edited on Fri Jul 27th, 2012 12:44 pm by Ted Johnson
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| Posted: Fri Jul 27th, 2012 05:29 pm |
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3rd Post |
Butch Kavanagh
Member
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when you purge the engine, we all have our choice of gas and what oil to use. all who suggest--are good ideas. i've been away from track activity for years but today's pump gas may not work well enough. i suggested to vince on his and gary's equipment...gas, straight gas (no ethonol or a gal of racing gas...oil, marvel mystery oil (which has no additives), 8-10 oz per gal. you are not going to over rev nor run a long time. don't use marvel for racing or practice, only to purge and when rebuilding
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| Posted: Fri Jul 27th, 2012 05:37 pm |
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4th Post |
bill younger
Member
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i'm going to use VP C-12 racing gas and klotz super techniplate. that's my intention right now unless somebody can tell me it's a bad idea. i don't want to start with alky...but i can see where it has it's advantages, and a small disadvantage (purging). thanks for the input so far!! bill
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| Posted: Fri Jul 27th, 2012 05:53 pm |
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5th Post |
Ted Johnson
Member
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Butch is spot on about the gasolines of today. They SUCK. We always used to use marine white gas for purging, though I don't know if it's still available. No lead, no ethanol. I've never tried Marvel Mystery for purge, but it is a very good lube, and has been for many years. Butch, what ratio do you use with Marvel for purge fuel?
I had recently decided to switch back to gasoline, because I hated purging the engines, but I've gone back to Alky again. The advantages outweigh the shortcomings. There are more engines stuck on gas, because of the heat, and because there is less oil running thru the engine. I can't remember EVER sticking an engine on alcohol. TJ
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| Posted: Fri Jul 27th, 2012 07:08 pm |
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6th Post |
Butch Kavanagh
Member
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8-10 oz per gal. many of the synthetic oils we use today may have a 20% ratio of castor. spark plugs are cheap insurance. we may not use an engine for months. my 92 is in the bedroom closet, plug out, stuffer plate loose and approx once month, take out, pour small amt of marvel thru spark plug hole amd turn crank over. stuffer off and marvel via long stemmed oil can, squirt the wrist pin bearings and turn crank over. let drain. i don't mean to insult anyone with this info as this is 'simple care' but these engine somehow 'dry out' between events
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| Posted: Fri Jul 27th, 2012 07:27 pm |
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7th Post |
Ted Johnson
Member
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Thanks, Butch. here in Arizona, we don't seem to have a problem between events. I usually run rich on my purge oil so as to coat the inside of the engine, but moisture isn't an issue. I also run a pretty rich mix of castor at 10/12 Oz./Gal. of alky. I keep the Swoopster/101 in my tile-floored kitchen/dining room, but the 610 is in the shop, no A/C or heat. Ron Cubel keeps Sue's '91 in the garage with no issues. I was born/raised in Brevard County; Melbourne and West Melbourne. I lived in Titusville for about 20 years, so I know what the Florida climate can do to bores, bearings and cranks! I grew up in Pop's small engine shop, and had a kart shop for several years in West Melbourne. I will get myself some Marvel Mystery for Fremont. Take care. Ted
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| Posted: Fri Jul 27th, 2012 07:57 pm |
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8th Post |
| Posted: Fri Jul 27th, 2012 08:32 pm |
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9th Post |
bill younger
Member
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do i need to keep oil on the piston while storing the kart? it has break-in time only, on gas... if i cover the exhaust hole and cover the engine is that enough? i'm a newby! Last edited on Fri Jul 27th, 2012 08:33 pm by bill younger
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| Posted: Fri Jul 27th, 2012 08:47 pm |
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10th Post |
Ted Johnson
Member
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Bill, somebody else will have to address the avgas issue. Some people say it causes problems. I don't know. It's always a good idea to remove the plug, run the piston down until it is just covers the exhaust and shoot a squirt of oil in there. WD-40 or Marvel Mystery, or even 3-in-one are all good. Turn the engine over slowly and replace the plug. TJ
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| Posted: Fri Jul 27th, 2012 10:05 pm |
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11th Post |
Tony Maynard
Member
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bill at barnesville last year i think i was the only one on gas. i ran the vp racing gas but i am going to alky this year. i run the blendzall castor oil from comet kart sales. its also for alky also. but when i flush my carb i flush with a non ethanol gas with a non castor oil with some marvel mystery oil. i flush it at the track and flush it when i get home to get the castor out of the motor
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| Posted: Sat Jul 28th, 2012 12:06 am |
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12th Post |
Michael Burke
Member
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I've used 100LL Avgas in my KT100's for at least 18 years when not actually racing them and I've never seen any problems develop by using it. Avgas won't pass the fuel test at IKF events, so we had to use the spec track fuel like all the other competitors. I live on an airport so the Avgas is easy to get for practice days. It also smells like race gas. 8-) It stores for long periods with little to no loss of performance. It doesn't seem to leave anything nasty in the carbs after even a year of storage. I start my engines for one brief 30 second run at the end of the day before I drain the tanks and put the karts back up on the wall of the trailer. I choke them to shut them off on that last start to leave more oil in the engine. I make sure the engine has completely cooled off before I do that last 30 second run. I want the oil to stay in the motor and not be hot enough to gum up. I usually run a synthetic oil on play days to minimize gumming things up while in storage. For engines not on a kart and being stored I pour Marvel into them and turn them in all attitudes to coat everything. I've taken cylinders off engines in storage a year later and the Marvel is still wet and coating everything nicely. I have some Mc's that have been stored for multiple years and when I took the stuffers off the insides were still wet with Marvel.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 28th, 2012 04:41 am |
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13th Post |
Terry Bentley
Member
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Double on the AV gas. Only IKF events where they required spec gas/oil did I not run it. Never slowed me down or caused any engine faliures. I always heard everyone saying how dry AV gas was and didnt lubricate. I just laughed and said thats why you add oil.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 28th, 2012 05:21 am |
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14th Post |
Tom Smith
Member
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Gas fuel/air ratio is 14.7 - 1
Methanol fuel/air ratio is 6.0 - 1
3 - 4 times more is new info to me.
Last edited on Sat Jul 28th, 2012 05:29 am by Tom Smith
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| Posted: Sat Jul 28th, 2012 02:42 pm |
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15th Post |
| Posted: Sat Jul 28th, 2012 04:24 pm |
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16th Post |
Ted Johnson
Member
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Sorry, Tom. My math was faulty. air/gasoline is considered 14.7/1, air to methanol is usually considered 6.0-6.5/1. I'm getting on! You'd think after 67 years that I could divide! You're still shoving a lot more lubricant through your engine with methanol. The last time I stuck an engine, I was running synthetic oil with gasoline while breaking in my open Atlas I. That was in 1978! TJ Last edited on Sat Jul 28th, 2012 04:28 pm by Ted Johnson
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| Posted: Sat Jul 28th, 2012 05:19 pm |
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17th Post |
Pruit Ginsberg
Member
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In th old days it was about twice as much alcohol as gas and in dry hot climate never did purging except loosening the back screws on the flatback.
when we practiced at the airport, we used the abundant 130 Av gas, and once in a while had a lead ball between the electrode and ground. That's all.
The 100 LL would help the lead fouling a bunch.
Michael has way more time on av gas though.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 28th, 2012 07:59 pm |
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18th Post |
Michael Burke
Member
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I haven't noticed any lead fouling of my plugs, but the currently sold 100LL probably has a lot less lead in it than the earlier avgas had. There used to be 4 grades of avgas. Now they only sell the 100LL. In the past they had 80/87 (dyed red) 100/130 LL (dyed green) 100/130 high lead (dyed blue) and 115/145 (dyed purple) The 115/145 was typically used in the higher hp military and civilian engines of the era. The other 3 grades were most often seen at smaller airports. Since 115/145 is no longer produced the air racers at Reno have had to come up with additives to run their high output WWII era engines.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 28th, 2012 08:02 pm |
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19th Post |
| Posted: Sat Jul 28th, 2012 08:10 pm |
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20th Post |
Ted Johnson
Member
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Michael, an Idaho friend of mine, Scott Crandlemire, used to run Formula 1 at Reno with a much modified Cassut Racer. I never asked him what fuel he ran in the Continental 0-200, do you know? Ted
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